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Smacking. Yes or No? - 1 to 30
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Jay21000
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Mon 12th Jul '04 11:56PM
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Simple. Should smacking your own children be illegal?

By 'smack', I mean open hand and quick slap across the arm/legs/butt cheek - I DON'T mean hitting.

I'll save my opinion for later.

Dregan
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Tue 13th Jul '04 11:03AM
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I broadly agree [I know smacking never did me any harm], but the problem is you have to think of the lowest common denominator - the fuckos who would take it too far, and beat the shit out of their children, but 'the government said it's ok'.

However, if there's one thing I despise it's people who smack their children in public, like in shops and on the street and so on. I realise the necessity of administering the punishment immediately [children have no concept of antici...] but there's a line, y'know? Smacking should most definitely be a last resort, not a primary method.
    

Spanners*
Misses his big brother :(
Tue 13th Jul '04 1:48PM
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Smacking leads to anger, anger leads to fear, fear leads to hate, hate leads to the dark side. Says I. Shout, stop their pocket money, make em eat tofu but don't be giving them bruises.
    

General*
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Tue 13th Jul '04 2:19PM
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Government says smacking good bruises bad.
That's the recent law change.

Kids learn by imitation. Hit your kids when they do somthing you don't like and they will hit other kids at school when they do something they don't like.
    

BrightonBabe
Would you like to see me blink? It really is quite impressive.
Tue 13th Jul '04 4:05PM
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I say shouting and making them sit alone for 5 minutes to think about what they've done is much better than smacking as in a childs eyes this is a way of getting someone to do what they want and what they think is right - this could lead to some nasty people in a later life. It also makes a scared environment in the house
 

Demian*
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Tue 13th Jul '04 5:09PM
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'So you think teaching children at an early age that violence is an acceptable solution to life's problems will make them more valuable members of society?'


Name that quote and win a turnip! And add my vote for the liberals!
  

Swoop*
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Tue 13th Jul '04 5:39PM
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I wasn't smacked as a kid, (or after that) and I'm a workshy lazy lump. I disagree with smacking kids at all though, and especially in public, which isn't just about the physical side of it for the kids, it's public humiliation for the little squirts too.
There should be a law allowing passers by to give the parent in question a gentle belt round the chops, just in passing.
I remember as a fairly small kid seeing a woman laying into her son with a stick in the middle of a busy high street, and being totally shocked and sickened.
 

Jay21000
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Tue 13th Jul '04 7:48PM
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I would definately agree that in public is not the ideal place to smack a kid, but like was said earlier, a punishment has to be associated with misbehaviour, and so later wouldn't work and would leave the child confused.

As an overall principle, I would say that there is nothing wrong with a good smack. I was smacked as a kid, and soon realised that being naughty = a smack. I am now one of the least violent people on the planet, never been in a fight etc etc. BUT sometimes, a smack is needed to teach the blasted little sh1t that what has just been done is wrong. I reiterate that a smack should NEVER be with a closed hand. One quick swipe across the arse, legs, arms may provoke tears and sulking, but I bet my life savings that kid won't do it again for a while.

I guess it's all down to personal opinion, and that is exactly what it should be. The government shouldn't enforce a no smacking law because it takes authority away from parents, and potentially rigs them as criminals just for caring enough to discipline their OWN kids.

Smacking... Yes
Violent abuse... NO

General*
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Wed 14th Jul '04 11:58AM
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Jay21000 was bold enough to comment:

I am now one of the least violent people on the planet, never been in a fight etc etc. BUT sometimes, a smack is needed to teach the blasted little sh1t that what has just been done is wrong.


So not actually the least violent person.
Violent Abuse: NO
Self Abuse: YES!
    

Jay21000
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Wed 14th Jul '04 11:20PM
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Self abuse is a whole new story, and perhaps worthy of its own thread?

Is there a self abuse smiley? Spanners... Over to you. Make it happen!

Spanners*
Misses his big brother :(
Thu 15th Jul '04 6:08PM
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OK, you asked for it...



(I'm so so sorry)
    

Jay21000
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Thu 15th Jul '04 7:22PM
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Fansastic. How on earth did you do it? And so so quickly?


General*
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Fri 16th Jul '04 12:18PM
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Wow those little guys are really smacking.
    

Malcolm*
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Fri 16th Jul '04 10:37PM
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Good grief! I presume you didn't make that smiley yourself, Spanners?

And might I say how relieved I am to see that most users of this thread (so far) are of a similar opinion to me - ie against. Although I enjoy a hearty debate as much as the next man (whom I think is probably Derek next door), there are certain issues on which I feel extremely uncomfortable when I discover that I'm in the same place as somebody who is of the opposite opinion - capital punishment is one, and this is another...

However, I don't really feel like writing any kind of long treatise. Hey, it's Friday and I'm chillin' with an Old Peculiar. But for what it's worth, a few points on the subject:

  1. I recently heard a bloke on a phone-in radio programme make a really good point (yes, I know, it's a contradiction in terms, etc). He said that people who claim that "being smacked never did me any harm" are proving themselves wrong, because they have grown up finding it acceptable to hit children. This in itself shows that it did do them some harm.


  2. Again on the "never did me any harm" issue: I personally wasn't smacked, and it never did me any harm. I am also a well-adjusted individual, respected by my peers and employed by the state to offer guidance to young people in their hour of need. Conclusion: personal anecdotes are just individual examples, and offer no insight whatsoever on what is a wider, philosophical question about what actions our society considers to be morally justified.


  3. People have said that they can understand a parent resorting to smacking when they're at the end of their tether, with nothing left to try. This seems to me to encourage the idea that a parent can smack a child in the heat of the moment, if they're annoyed enough. Actually, I know this is an exaggeration - but such an action certainly gives the message that if you're really worked up, it's OK to hit someone. This is a terrible message to instil in a child. Far too many adults already employ this line of reasoning - we don't need any more.


  4. On the other side of the coin: I had a conversation with a friend once who said that if a parent really considers that a smack is deserved, then administering it will save further hours or days of tension. The child will be smacked and then all will be forgiven - he/she will know that he/she deserved it because it will have been explained to them beforehand, and they'll be welcomed back into the family fold straight afterwards. This, to me, is even more sinister than the previous point - it's cold-blooded and calculated, as well as implying that receiving a brief physical attack adequately cancels out a person's wrongdoings. Again, this is not the kind of message we want people to grow up with.


  5. And finally (although a much repeated point, I think it's the one most fundamentally difficult to argue with): Don't children deserve the same protection in their homes as adults already have?


At that point, though, I'll stop rather abruptly and go to the pub. Not due to annoyance - it's just that it's 22:36 and it'll be last orders soon. Goodnight everyone!
   

General*
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Sat 17th Jul '04 1:19PM
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Bravo!
That is approaching the best treatise against smacking I've ever heard.

Also when people say I was/wasn't smacked and it never did me any harm; I can never quite work out how they got hold of an identical twin who shared all of their experiences with the exception of smacking. Because surely otherwise you have no frame of reference.

These chaps seem to think that rough treatment is bad for boys development: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/3871545.stm
    

Spanners*
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Mon 19th Jul '04 1:47PM
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Mighty mighty post there Mr Malcolm, I think that's the end of the debate right there!
    

Malcolm*
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Mon 19th Jul '04 2:21PM
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Ooh dear - didn't mean to come on quite so strongly ! Well, I'd had a hard day...

Anyway, respect to Jay for raising the subject here on the forum - it's always interesting, if daring, to open such things up for debate in a place like this. Any other views, anyone?
   

Demian*
Oh Lordy, Plegaleggole
Mon 19th Jul '04 5:04PM
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I've said it before and I'll undoubtedly say it again, but Malcolm is wiser than 4 cubic metres of owls.


So, did you make it to last orders?
  

General*
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Mon 19th Jul '04 5:44PM
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Demian was bold enough to comment:

I've said it before and I'll undoubtedly say it again, but Malcolm is wiser than 4 cubic metres of owls.




Wow!
I make that 1.74 PI3 pound stoats per hectare in old money.
Though what's the packing density of Owls in a viscous fluid?
    

Malcolm*
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Tue 20th Jul '04 4:33PM
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Demian was bold enough to comment:

So, did you make it to last orders?



Certainly did! Though, I'm pleased to say, no peculiar creamy chocolate and milk drinks this time.
   

Malcolm*
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Tue 20th Jul '04 4:37PM
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General was bold enough to comment:



Demian was bold enough to comment:

I've said it before and I'll undoubtedly say it again, but Malcolm is wiser than 4 cubic metres of owls.




Wow!
I make that 1.74 PI3 pound stoats per hectare in old money.
Though what's the packing density of Owls in a viscous fluid?



Also depends on the type of owl: if we're talking snowy owls, then that's probably about three times the number of owls per cubic metre of owl; so, 3 times the number of owl brains. Not necessarily three times the quantity of owl brain, though. Plus, we'd have to factor in each owl species's relative wisdom...

Also, thanks to General for inadvertently teaching me a new comedy html feature.

E=MCowl
   

Demian*
Oh Lordy, Plegaleggole
Tue 20th Jul '04 8:13PM
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Malcolm was bold enough to comment:
no peculiar creamy chocolate and milk drinks this time.



YATES
  

General*
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Wed 21st Jul '04 9:54AM
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But are we in favour of smacking owls?
    

Malcolm*
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Wed 21st Jul '04 11:04AM
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General was bold enough to comment:

But are we in favour of smacking owls?



I decided to do some research before forming my opinion on this one. A Google Images search for owl smacking reveals no results whatsoever! I can see Googlewhack potential there...

However, an image search for smacking owls came up with only the following picture:


   

General*
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Wed 21st Jul '04 12:33PM
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What about animals beating clothes!
    

Demian*
Oh Lordy, Plegaleggole
Wed 21st Jul '04 11:40PM
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I was trying to find a good 'Red X' image for General, but I couldn't resist posting this instead...

  

Dregan
a flim flam is as good as a shim sham sam
Thu 22nd Jul '04 10:42AM
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Spanners*
Misses his big brother :(
Thu 22nd Jul '04 1:36PM
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I'm not in favour of smacking owls, but I've known a cockatoo that needed a good beating!

(someone had to make the joke sooner or later)
    

General*
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Thu 22nd Jul '04 4:48PM
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How about an Owl smacking smiley?
    

Malcolm*
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Fri 23rd Jul '04 9:53AM
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Cockatoo? What?

Ohhhh - I see...
   

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